Emmy Winner Tom Bramel on Revitalizing Classical Music for New Audiences

Emmy Winner Tom Bramel on Revitalizing Classical Music for New Audiences

In this episode of the Open Forum in The Villages, Florida, host Mike Roth speaks with Emmy-winning classical music composer Tom Bramel. Tom discusses his journey from a shy clarinet player to a renowned composer, sharing anecdotes from his career, including composing for PBS documentaries and winning an Emmy. They delve into the decline of classical music's popularity in America and Tom's efforts to revitalize it through his nonprofit, Three Essential Elements. The episode also features a clip of Tom's composition 'The Leprechaun,' insights from brain health expert Dr. Craig Curtis, and engaging conversation about the vibrant music community in The Villages.

00:00 Introduction to the Open Forum
00:57 Support the Podcast
01:38 Meet Tom Bramel: Emmy-Winning Composer
02:24 Tom's Musical Journey
03:51 Scoring for PBS and Winning an Emmy
06:21 Life at the Library of Congress
08:02 Challenges in Classical Music
10:35 Tom's Recent Works and Performances
12:14 Alzheimer's Tip from Dr. Craig Curtis
13:15 Modern Classical Music Today
13:50 Three Essential Elements Organization
22:48 Classical Music in The Villages
25:08 Conclusion and Listener Shoutouts

Transcript

Emmy Winner Tom Bramel on Revitalizing Classical Music for New Audiences

[00:00:00] Nancy: Welcome to the Open Forum in The Villages, Florida. In this show, we talk to leaders of clubs and interesting folks who live here in the Villages. To get perspectives of what is happening here in The Villages Florida, we are a listener supported podcast. There will be shout outs for supporters in episodes.

[00:00:25] Mike Roth: This is Mike Roth. Listeners, I'm thrilled to share with you this podcast, which is my passion project for you. This podcast brings you knowledge, inspiration, and a lot of things that people need to know about The Villages and the people living here. Be sure to hit the follow button to get the newest episode each week.

Creating this podcast is a labor of love. Even though it demands more time, I can easily spare. Now, here's where you come in. You can help us keep the podcast alive and thriving. How? By becoming a supporter. The easy way for you to support us is to visit our podcast webpage OpenForumTheVillagesFlorida.com, and click on the supporter button at the top of the page.

Or the purple supporter box. Even a small donation of three to $10 a month makes a big difference, and you can cancel your subscription at any time. Your support means the world to us. Stay curious, stay inspired, and keep those headphones on. I hope everyone enjoys today's show.

I'm here today with Tom Bramel thanks for joining me, Tom.

[00:01:42] Tom Bremel: It's nice to be here. 

[00:01:43] Mike Roth: Good. Tom introduced himself to me the first time as a classical music composer, and I went, wow. I didn't know he had any of those in America anymore. But Tom

is an Emmy winning classical music composer, and he's written music for plays , 

And PBS documentaries. Tom has a nonprofit called Three Essential Elements, and he is revitalizing classical chamber music with audience friendly concerts and stunning new recordings. Tom's mission is to make 

this 

timeless art form vibrant and accessible showcasing gorgeous. modern music.

Tom, how old were you when you started in music ? 

[00:02:28] Tom Bremel: I started when I was a kid, but I didn't get into composition until I was in my mid twenties, which is kinda late, 

[00:02:36] Mike Roth: You started as a pianist or a violinist, 

[00:02:40] Tom Bremel: I played clarinet. 

[00:02:41] Mike Roth: What moved you to become a composer? 

[00:02:44] Tom Bremel: I was a shy clarinet player and I never liked to be in front of people for concerts. And when you're a composer, you can step in the background If you write something and you're afraid of how it's gonna be, you just can stay home and not go to the concert.

You don't have to be in front of an audience. 

[00:03:01] Mike Roth: The reviews. 

[00:03:02] Tom Bremel: Read the reviews. Somebody else can be in front of the audience and I didn't have to do that. 

[00:03:06] Mike Roth: Was there anything in your family that was musical? 

[00:03:09] Tom Bremel: Nobody in my family was musical.

I had no pressure to go in that direction.

[00:03:14] Mike Roth: how is it that you picked up the clarinet? 

[00:03:16] Tom Bremel: When you're a little kid and they offer band in school you go to the teacher and the teacher says I'd like to have you play clarinet. That's what happened.

[00:03:26] Mike Roth: He hands you a 

[00:03:26] Tom Bremel: I didn't wanna play flute because that was for girls.

[00:03:29] Mike Roth: You're lucky he didn't hand you a tuba. 

[00:03:31] Tom Bremel: That's true. 

[00:03:32] Mike Roth: When I started in music, they handed me a trumpet. 

[00:03:35] Tom Bremel: You know how they say when you play a trumpet in the marching band, the best way to warm up for marching band with a trumpet is to put it up to your mouth and walk into the wall.

[00:03:43] Mike Roth: I Tom, at this point in time in your life, how many classical pieces of music do you think you've written? 

[00:03:49] Tom Bremel: Well over a hundred. 

[00:03:51] Mike Roth: How did you get hooked up with PBS to do music for their movies? 

[00:03:55] Tom Bremel: When I was first starting out, I started writing music for plays and plays didn't pay very much, so I knew I had to get into film work, I decided to put together my reel of audio excerpts, and called producers, it was very hard to get a producer on the phone. I did find one producer who would talk to me, and he happened to be doing a film on the Potomac River. I asked him, can I do the music for you? he said, what are your credits? And I said, I got some plays.

He said, what are your film credits? I said I don't have any. he said I can't. I got an expensive. Project here. I can't trust somebody that's not experienced. I said, look, just let me do one scene. I'll do it for free and you can see if I can do it. So I did one scene and he loved it. He said I don't know.

I said how about if I do a second scene? after I did seven scenes. I said, so I guess we're working together, right? he said, yeah. So I got the job. 

[00:04:48] Mike Roth: Did you get paid? 

[00:04:49] Tom Bremel: I got paid under what other people would get paid, but I still got paid, yes. 

[00:04:53] Mike Roth: Okay. 

[00:04:53] Tom Bremel: I got screen credit and my very first film I won an Emmy for. 

[00:04:58] Mike Roth: Really? what film was that? 

[00:05:00] Tom Bremel: The Potomac American Reflections. It was on PBS and I still see it every once in a while. they made it available to the schools in the state of Virginia.

The Potomac goes through Virginia. So every school in the state of Virginia has a copy of this film. 

[00:05:16] Mike Roth: What year 

[00:05:16] Tom Bremel: 1986. That's a while ago. 

[00:05:19] Mike Roth: And you were living in Virginia 

[00:05:21] Tom Bremel: I was living in Maryland at the time. 

[00:05:23] Mike Roth: So you only. Called producers on the east coast or did you call the West Coast guys as well?

[00:05:28] Tom Bremel: I knew from experience that I had to be on the west coast. I couldn't just be calling them so they would wanna see me and they want me in the area. Washington, DC area was doing a lot of documentary work and some work for the government too. So I stayed in Washington trying to get credits.

[00:05:46] Mike Roth: Okay. how many films has your music been in 

[00:05:49] Tom Bremel: I got another award for a film called George Mason and the Bill of Rights and that was a Golden Eagle Award. 

[00:05:58] Mike Roth: And what was the last film that you had your music in? 

[00:06:01] Tom Bremel: Oh, that was probably the one I'm talking about.

That was the first one, the last one was probably the George Mason and the Bill of Rights. 

[00:06:09] Mike Roth: Do you remember what year that was? 

[00:06:10] Tom Bremel: That was 89 or 90. I got married, 

[00:06:14] Tom Bramel AI: and realized, this is not a very lucrative field.

So I took a day job. 

[00:06:20] Mike Roth: What'd you do as a day job? 

[00:06:21] Tom Bremel: I was the chief of the video production group at the Library of Congress.

So we made lots of films at the Library of Congress. Library of Congress is a very interesting place. celebrities and famous people

[00:06:34] Tom Bramel AI: would 

[00:06:34] Tom Bremel: come in there and give talks, so we would record them. Lots of concerts too. So we'd record the music concerts. 

Yeah. They're online 

[00:06:42] Mike Roth: I figured that, people get their book into the library of Congress, it goes into the basement and it's forgotten.

It's Got a number on it, 

[00:06:48] Tom Bremel: yeah. 

[00:06:49] Mike Roth: And they do community outreach programs. 

[00:06:51] Tom Bremel: We used to say that everybody from Obama to the Dalai Lama came to the library and lots of people did. Politicians, musicians, poets, authors. 

[00:07:02] Mike Roth: Who's the famous person that you remember most? 

[00:07:05] Tom Bramel AI: I was escorting Paul McCartney Around the library we were assigned to videotape Paul McCartney's visit The library had his copyrighted music from the Beatles. we were going to send a camera operator around the library with him.

He was getting this tour, so we had a camera operator recording Paul McCartney After about three hours, Paul told his people no more videotaping. we had a lady videotaping at the time and she kept on videotaping Paul's bodyguard said, no more videotaping. And she kept on videotaping he came over and pushed her. 

I wasn't there when this happened, so I found out about it and I said, oh my goodness, this is gonna be a big hassle.

[00:07:48] Mike Roth: Why do you think he didn't want you to shoot anymore video? 

[00:07:52] Tom Bremel: He was just tired. It turns out that the camera operator, was thrilled that she could go tell people that she was pushed around by. Paul McCartney's bodyguard. 

[00:08:02] Mike Roth: Let's talk about classical music in the American population. Classical music seems to have fallen into a low spot, with all that rap music coming out. What do you think has caused that? 

[00:08:14] Tom Bremel: There's several things that happened.

probably the biggest thing was that in the radio industry short pieces, pop pieces started being very popular. 

And school music programs stopped teaching classical music, and then in colleges they started teaching composers to write atonal music.

[00:08:34] Mike Roth: What kind of music? 

[00:08:36] Tom Bremel: Atonal music. That doesn't sound like anything you ever want to hear. 

[00:08:40] Mike Roth: It was Like a John Cage stuff. 

[00:08:41] Tom Bremel: Yeah. Or worse, yeah. Things that are, basically noise. And it appealed to other classical composers in universities so they could talk about.

The music and they didn't have to think about the audience. The only place that really survived classical music for the audience was in film music. John Williams is a good example of that. His scores for movies are turned into great scores for the orchestra.

So there's One place left where you can hear really good classical music, and that's in the movies. 

[00:09:15] Mike Roth: Really? I thought John Williams 

[00:09:16] Mike: did Star Wars? 

[00:09:17] Tom Bremel: Oh, yeah.

[00:09:18] Mike Roth: Okay. that was classical music, by definition. 

[00:09:21] Tom Bremel: It's film music, but when you hear it by itself, you realize that it has all the earmarks of the great classical composers.

So he's actually a great classical composer. 

[00:09:31] Mike Roth: What is the, biggest. misconception about classical music that people here in America have today. 

[00:09:37] Tom Bremel: That it's snooty that it's for the people that can afford expensive tickets to go to the concert hall and wear their tuxedos. I'd say that's probably one of the biggest misconceptions.

For instance, chamber music is designed to be. Very personal to people, small ensembles, 2, 3, 4 players. they want to reach the audience in a small room so the audience becomes part of it. And it can be very emotional, very exciting. So people don't understand that it can be very personal and very moving and very emotional.

[00:10:11] Mike Roth: Yeah. I see that on cruise ships. Because it seems to me that every cruise ship I've been on in the grand foyer area, in the middle of the afternoon, they'll have three young ladies playing violins cellos and classical type music. They usually have a pretty good audience,

at least on a cruise Ship. And it's a big echoey room, so they really filled the room with sound. It's. very nice actually. You gave me some samples of your classical music. Of the pieces that you gave me, which one would you like our listeners to hear 30 or 40 seconds of. 

[00:10:48] Tom Bremel: All of my pieces Are my babies. So to pick one is difficult. But I'll pick the Leprechaun. I think you might like it. It's also a very simple piece. It has only one instrument, the flute, but it captures the idea of a playful and slightly mysterious leprechaun.

[00:11:05] Mike Roth: So let's listen to about 30 to 40 seconds of the Leprechaun. 

[00:11:46] Mike Roth: Tom,

What year did you create the leprechaun piece? 

[00:11:49] Tom Bremel: That was only a couple of years ago. After I retired, I started composing again, and that was one of the early pieces we put together for our organization. we had a large concert in Berlin where the flutist played.

[00:12:05] Mike Roth: So that one hasn't been in a movie yet? 

[00:12:07] Tom Bremel: No, it's not in a movie. there is a video of the piece on YouTube with the flutist playing.

[00:12:12] Mike Roth: I'm glad you picked that one. Let's take a short break and listen to an Alzheimer's tip from Dr. Craig Curtis.

Dr. Curtis, can you give , our listeners a tip on keeping their brain healthy? 

[00:12:27] Dr. Craig Curtis: Absolutely. My favorite tip is, involves a change in eating patterns, but it's not a drastic change. It's simply increasing the amount of fresh fruits and vegetables, fish, other white meats, and lowering the amounts of red meat.

Sweets and sugars, and also carbohydrates. It's essentially following a Mediterranean type diet plan. 

[00:12:58] Warren: With over 20 years of experience studying brain health, Dr. Curtis's goal is to educate the village's community on how to live a longer, healthier life. To learn more, visit his website, craigcurtismd.com, or call 3 5 2 5 0 0 5 2 5 2 to attend a free seminar.

[00:13:14] Mike Roth: Thank you, Dr. Curtis. I'm back with Tom Bramel and we're talking about modern classical music.

If you would've told me I was gonna do a show on modern classical music three months ago I would've knocked myself on the head. There's no such a thing. 

I'm thinking of Tchaikovsky and Beethoven and Mozart and all those guys.

But there are, how many people now writing classical music? 

[00:13:37] Tom Bremel: Right now there's 15 people in my organization. 15 composers. They're from all over the world. 

There's some people from Russia, Spain, France. Israel, Germany, 

Italy. 

[00:13:50] Mike Roth: Your organization is called Three Essential Elements, right?

Can you tell us what that means? 

[00:13:56] Tom Bremel: One of the problems, like I mentioned earlier, is that

Composers stopped writing music for the audience. So the three essential elements are, of course, you gotta start with a composer and the performer, but the audience is the third. And most important group to be a part of your organization.

So the audience is number one in our organization. 

[00:14:19] Mike Roth: How do you involve the audience? 

[00:14:21] Tom Bremel: Besides having the audience 

[00:14:22] Tom Bramel AI: come to the concerts we involved them by making suggestions for. New works suggesting venues where we might perform, we can perform in churches, concert halls, lots of different places. It could actually be somebody's living room.

[00:14:35] Mike Roth: You've done performances in people's living rooms? 

[00:14:38] Tom Bremel: Oh, yes. Large living rooms. they're not my living room. 

[00:14:41] Mike Roth: Have you done any performances of your pieces? Here in The Villages area. 

[00:14:45] Tom Bremel: It's interesting. We've done concerts mostly in Europe and we're gonna have our very first concert in Virginia and Florida next year in 2026.

And it's gonna be performed by the Rera Brothers violin and piano duo. And they're going to be playing new works from all over the world For that ensemble. 

[00:15:08] Mike Roth: Where's that gonna be? Done

here in central Florida? 

[00:15:11] Tom Bremel: The venue's not been selected yet. there's a couple of churches that we're looking at right now.

[00:15:17] Mike Roth: That would be a good venue. 

[00:15:19] Tom Bremel: Churches are very interesting. In Spain we try to do concerts in churches But often if it's not religious music, they don't wanna have the concert in the church. 

[00:15:28] Mike Roth: Around here they've had barbershop quartet concerts in churches . 

So I wouldn't call barbershop music, particularly religious. I'm sure you could get into a church if you wanted to. On these sample pieces of music that you gave me they were all short.

How long is the whole piece? 

[00:15:46] Tom Bremel: One of the things in general when we put out a new piece, there are a minimum of seven minutes. They could be much longer, 18 minutes. 

[00:15:55] Mike Roth: Okay. So when you gave me the piece, Jay's lyre.

And that's. I only have a one minute clip of that. It's really a much longer piece.

[00:16:03] Tom Bremel: Jay's lawyer is part of a much longer concert. And it's only about four and a half minutes. 

[00:16:07] Mike Roth: Do you guys in the three elements group. Give awards for the best new classical piece each year? 

[00:16:14] Tom Bremel: Oh, no. We're all colleagues and we wouldn't do that to each other. There is a slight bit of competition among us, but most of us really respect the other composers in the group. For instance we have professors from the Paris Conservatory, from the Athens, Greece Conservatory St. Petersburg Conservatory and the Moscow Conservatory. all of these people are really great composers. we have several people who work in television. They're all very good composers. They all have different styles, but they all want to meet with the audience.

They want to have the audience enjoy their works. They don't really care about winning prizes. They're all professionals. They've all been experienced with lots of work in the past. 

[00:17:01] Mike Roth: When you put everyone together for a concert in America next year, how do you select which new classical pieces are going to be performed?

[00:17:13] Tom Bremel: That's a good question. what I do is I say, here's a project that we're going to do. Let me know if you wanna participate. Some people are so busy they don't have the time to write a new piece. So after I find out how many of the 15 composers want to do the piece, I can say, okay, 

[00:17:29] Tom Bramel AI: we have a 

[00:17:31] Tom Bremel: certain number of people and an hour and a half concert time, and I just divide the time up and say, everybody's got a limit of seven minutes.

[00:17:39] Mike Roth: When was the last time you did one of these concerts? 

[00:17:41] Tom Bremel: We did several last year. For instance the Greek Lyre piece that 

Was just performed at University of Tampa last year. We also performed a piece called the ERA Rat for string trio piano, trio for violin.

[00:17:59] Mike Roth: When you have these concerts, do you record the whole concert so someone could buy a video or

[00:18:04] Mike Roth AI 9-11-24: an audio

version? 

[00:18:06] Tom Bremel: Most of the time we make a professional recording, assuming we have the funding. our latest recording is for flute, violin. Cello and piano, it just came out last month and 

[00:18:21] Tom Bramel AI: has 

[00:18:21] Tom Bremel: gotten some very nice reviews.

[00:18:24] Tom Bramel AI: There are 10 composers on that album from London, Moscow here in the States. I'm on the album and several other countries 

[00:18:32] Mike Roth: So if one of our listeners wanted to get a hold of the album, where would they go? 

[00:18:37] Tom Bremel: They can come to the three Essential Elements website and learn about every concert.

[00:18:40] Mike Roth: The Essential Elements.org 

concert albums are available for sale there.

[00:18:46] Tom Bremel: They're there, but you'll also be able to listen to them online for free.

[00:18:50] Mike Roth: okay.

[00:18:50] Tom Bremel: Our goal is to reach new audiences, That's why we're a nonprofit. We support ourselves with audience donations. 

[00:18:59] Mike Roth: What's the largest audience you've had for one of the concerts?

[00:19:02] Tom Bremel: We probably average about a hundred, sometimes less, sometimes more and that's pretty good for chamber music. 

[00:19:09] Mike Roth: And when you guys do a performance, you have to rent a hall. 

[00:19:12] Tom Bremel: What happens is. all the musicians we work with, all the performers, have their own connections. some of the performers work at colleges. And can perform

[00:19:20] Tom Bramel AI: there. 

Other musicians have jobs at churches.

So they all have connections. And don't necessarily have to rent halls.

[00:19:31] Mike Roth: Oh, that's good. Now, when a composer, completes a piece of classical music. How is it registered copyrighted ?

[00:19:40] Tom Bremel: In the States. I think technically once you sign it it's yours, but you can register it in the copyright office.

It's a relatively simple, straightforward process. 

[00:19:51] Mike Roth: Have you done that with your music? 

[00:19:52] Tom Bremel: The law reads that once it's pinned, it's mine. somebody might say I wrote it before you wrote it, so for instance, you could put the piece in an envelope and send it to yourself and not open the envelope.

That would prove to the court that you had it by a certain date. 

Not that I would love to be sued but that's not gonna happen, I don't think. 

[00:20:13] Mike Roth: Does an organization like ASCAP collect royalties if your music is used in elevator music? 

[00:20:19] Tom Bremel: I'm a member of ASCAP and I think the last check I got was I could go to McDonald's with 

[00:20:24] Mike Roth: So about $10 

[00:20:25] Tom Bremel: So classical music is not something you wanna do. if you just wanna make a living You can get into film music. That's the one place that pays well, but if you wanna write classical music for the concert hall, it's very difficult.

[00:20:38] Mike Roth: Where does someone go? Who wants to learn how to write classical music? 

[00:20:42] Tom Bremel: Most people go to conservatories. Conservatories are good for a couple of things. One, your major whatever it is you wanna learn. for instance, if I wanna learn composition, I have to find a composition teacher that teaches somewhere.

And usually they're in universities because they get paid there. And suppose I wanted to play clarinet and there was a good clarinet player there too. So two things that are needed to make a good school. 

[00:21:07] Mike Roth: Two things to make a good conservatory, or school of music are 

[00:21:12] Tom Bremel: If you're a violinist and that's your major subject, then you wanna study with a great violin player and you wanna play in a great orchestra. So if the school has a great violin player and a great orchestra, then you go there.

Everything else you take doesn't really matter. 'cause those are the two things that mostly count for your future as a performer. 

[00:21:30] Mike Roth: Here in our podcast 96 or 97%. is listened to in America or Canada. So how many good music conservatories are there in our two countries? 

[00:21:43] Tom Bremel: I'll tell you a story. There's a jazz school in Boston. The Berkeley School of Music.

[00:21:49] Mike Roth: Boston has a jazz school. I expected that to be in New Orleans.

[00:21:53] Tom Bremel: Yeah. It's a school for jazz. I went to visit one day and it happened to be the day that parents were visiting the school. 

They gave people a tour of the school 

[00:22:04] Tom Bramel AI: We We're in a hall with lots of studios, teachers teaching, the people giving the tour asked, how many of you are guitar players? About 10 students raised their hands. the tour guide said, you are in the right place. This is the hall for our guitar studios. today there are 300 guitar players at this school I wanted to yell Did you hear that? 300 guitar players in one school and everybody went, oh, then I'm in the right place. No, you're in the wrong field. The competition is very severe. 

[00:22:37] Mike Roth: Ah, if you were learning how to play the cello. And there were two cello players there, that would be a much better place.

[00:22:43] Tom Bremel: The competition for any instrument is very difficult to get a job. 

[00:22:48] Mike Roth: Do you follow classical music here in The Villages area? 

[00:22:52] Tom Bramel AI: "The Celebration Brass Band and The Villages Symphonic Winds, led by the highly respected conductor Lew Buckley, are top-notch.

[00:23:00] Mike Roth: I know there's a new french horn. 

[00:23:02] Tom Bremel: Yes, I've heard them. 

[00:23:03] Mike Roth: lot 

[00:23:03] Tom Bremel: They're residents of The Villages. They give interesting concerts. I've heard ' 

[00:23:07] Tom Bramel AI: them a couple of times. There's a lot of different interests in The Villages. Retired people come down here. Some are retired musicians, but mostly people that played high school.

Instruments or maybe sometimes in college and then went on with their lives now they're coming back to something they love. Clarinets get together, violins get together, horns get together. 

[00:23:27] Mike Roth: I went to the, performance of Fiddler on the Roof by the high school students.

The high school students were coached by an excellent instructor. They were fantastic. In fact, the whole play was fantastic. I was sitting in the second row and mesmerized by the music. At intermission, I looked down at the orchestra,

It was 

like a 21 or 22 piece orchestra.

Three of them were high school students, And the rest were villagers. 

[00:23:50] Tom Bremel: Oh. 

[00:23:50] Mike Roth: And it made the show 

[00:23:52] Tom Bremel: Yeah.

[00:23:53] Mike Roth: It was good to see the live music and the singing I don't know if you can call that classical music. It's more than 25 years old. Is there a number of years old that a classical song has to have to be called classical?

[00:24:06] Tom Bremel: It's soul or rock 

[00:24:08] Mike Roth: Are there three or four elements that have to be present?

[00:24:11] Tom Bremel: Good question. 

[00:24:12] Mike Roth: I've been accused of that a lot.

[00:24:14] Tom Bremel: Usually classical music has a more involved form. classical pieces are much longer and much more involved in their form. They also usually have lots of counterpoint. In other words, more than one melody going on at once.

[00:24:27] Mike Roth: And that's count the points of the players, the melodies played by different instruments. 

[00:24:33] Tom Bremel: Yes. 

[00:24:33] Mike Roth: Looking back at your career in classical music. What do you think is the single high point that you had? 

[00:24:39] Tom Bremel: Probably winning the Emmy, Actually it's a thrill. Every time I get a new recording of a piece like the Leprechaun they always thrill me because the performer brings something better to the experience than I imagined. It's always a little different than I thought it was going to be. 

[00:24:56] Mike Roth: The way you heard it when you were writing it isn't the way the performers create the piece for an audience?

[00:25:03] Tom Bremel: They do create it the way I heard it, and they add more to it. 

[00:25:08] Mike Roth: Tom, thanks for being with us on Open Forum in The Villages I'm gonna play a clip from 

[00:25:13] Mike: Jay's Lyre 

[00:26:16] Janine Evans: Remember, our next episode will be released next Friday at 9:00 AM. Should you wanna become a major supporter of the show or have questions, please contact us at mike@rothvoice.com. 

This is a shout out for supporters, Duane Roemmich

 , Tweet Coleman, Ed Williams, Paul Sorgen, and Dr. Craig Curtis at K 2 in The Villages.

We will be hearing more from Dr. Curtis with short Alzheimer's tips each week. If you know someone who should be on the show, contact us at mike@rothvoice.com. The way our show grows is with your help. Text your friends about this show. If you enjoyed listening or just tell your friends about the show. We thank everyone for listening.

The content of the show is copyrighted by Roth Voice 2025 .