From MRI's on Lions to Therapeutic Riding: A Vet's Diverse Career

Unveil the world of rural veterinary practice with Dr. Pam Pierceall, a seasoned vet with 37 years of experience in Iowa. With a lion named Buford and a private zoo in her repertoire, Pam walks us through the thrill and satisfaction of her career, right down to her decision to settle in a rural community. Her stories, ranging from performing an MRI on Buford to navigating the nuances of small-town practice, are sure to captivate you.

We then pivot to explore a fascinating link between veterinary medicine and foster kids with Dr. Craig Curtis, a brain health researcher. He highlights the significance of moderate exercise for brain health, setting the stage for Dr. Pierceall's recent passion project. She's been actively involved with the children of the Marion County Therapeutic Riding Association in Ocala, contributing her skills in an unexpected yet impactful manner. 

The episode wraps up with a candid conversation about the challenges of rural veterinary practices.  We talk about the transformative power of technology, and the leaps and bounds social media has made in the veterinary industry. Join us next Friday at 9 am for our next episode, and don't hesitate to connect if you have any questions or would like to support the show.

Transcript

Emily: 0:10

Welcome to the Open Forum in the Villages Florida podcast. In this show we talk to leaders in the community, leaders of clubs and interesting folks who live here in the villages to give perspectives of what is happening here in the villages. We are a listener-supported podcast. You can become a supporter for as little as $3 per month or you can choose to pay more. To become a supporter, go to openforminthevillagescom and click on support in the black box. There will be shoutouts for supporters in episodes.

Emily: 0:38

In season 4, we have made some dramatic improvements and changes. First is a clarification of the podcast's title. It is Open Forum in the Villages, florida, to make clear that this is a regional show, independently produced for folks who live in central Florida and the villages areas. Second is a dramatic increase in the use of AI in the creation of each episode. These include a transcript of each show. Please understand that there may be errors inserted by the AI that may not be caught before the transcript is published. However, this is a dramatic step forward. We will now include chapter markers for each show. The show description text will be AI generated. In fact, the show's announcers are now all AI voices, including me, emily. Hope you enjoy.

Mike Roth: 1:19

This is Mike Roth on Open Forum in the Villages. I'm here today with Dr Pam Piersol. I originally grew up in El Dorado, kansas, graduated from Fort Hayes State University in 1977 and received her Doctor of Veterinary Medicine from Kansas State in 1982. Pam has practiced veterinary medicine in Bloomfield, iowa, for 37 years and as a solo mixed animal practitioner, she owned her own practice in a small rural farming community. Her practice consisted of cattle all animals that chew their own herd, like cows, horses and companion animals. She also worked for a short time in a private zoo where she worked with several exotic animals like lions, bears and even a seal. Where was that zoo?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 2:06

Pam In Flores, Iowa, in the same county that I was living in.

Mike Roth: 2:11

Okay, what was the largest major city where you were living in?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 2:15

The largest city was Des Moines. That was 100 miles.

Mike Roth: 2:18

Okay, so you were really out in the summer.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 2:21

I was very rural. The whole county was 10,000 people, the entire county.

Mike Roth: 2:26

Hmm, so we can almost get that in two villages here in the village, exactly, yeah, so we're talking rural Iowa farming community. Good. So how long have you lived here in the villages? Five years and what village do you live in? Finney, f okay, yeah, I looked at Finney before I bought here.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 2:43

I liked it because it was rural. You know no rural right I had, the more country feel it doesn't anymore, but I still love it.

Mike Roth: 2:52

Yeah, big surprise.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 2:53

Yes.

Dr Craig Curtis: 2:55

They built 10,000 houses next to you? Yes, Good.

Mike Roth: 2:57

Pam is also serving as a volunteer for the Marion Therapeutic Riding Association, where she's both a veterinarian and on their board, yes, good. So, pam, why don't you tell our listeners why you decided to become a vet in the early 80s?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 3:14

Yeah, I worked for a veterinarian when I was in high school and I just really enjoyed the practice. I enjoyed the medicine part, the science, but I had no desire to go into human medicine. So when I went to Fort Hayes State I worked at a feedlot a 21,000 head feedlot, wrote pens worked on cattle and really, really enjoyed that. I worked for a veterinarian in Hayes and then went on to Kansas State to complete my practice.

Mike Roth: 3:43

Okay, after you completed your practice, why did you choose a rural community?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 3:48

Well, that's kind of a long and twisty story, but my husband had. At the time we had just gotten married and he found a. He was a farmer from Illinois and we found farm ground and we went there right after we were married and that's how we landed in Southeast Iowa.

Mike Roth: 4:06

Okay, what did you find as the most enjoyable part of your practice of veterinary medicine?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 4:12

I think, something different to do every day that it wasn't. It wasn't repetitious, every day was different. Every day was exciting. I was out in the outside working on cattle At the time. I did a lot of pigs and sheep and I worked in a strictly large animal practice and so that I started building their small animal practice. But it just, it was just exciting, did you say small animal.

Mike Roth: 4:40

Dogs and cats would be small animals.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 4:42

Yes, companion animals is what we call them.

Mike Roth: 4:46

Okay, why don't you tell others in a little bit about some of the experiences you had while working at the zoo?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 4:51

All right. Well, one of the things that actually made a national made an AP story was Buford was a lion. He was about three years old, about maybe 350, 400 pounds. He started having liver problems. So I'd been taking care of Buford since he was a cub, so he knew me and we actually had the opportunity to do an MRI on him to see what was wrong with his liver. So here we are and we're doing it in our human hospital.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 5:26

So we're bringing Buford the lion in a cage to the hospital, people are staring and we're wheeling him down the halls of our hospital. I had to give him some ketamine and because he was familiar with me, he knew me and he let me give him his ketamine and then, after he went, was sedated with his ketamine. Then I was able to put an IV in him and we did a ceratile drip. We put him in the MRI machine. We did not want him waking up inside the MRI machine, so I maintained the anesthesia and we put him in and we actually were on national news. I still have the newspaper clipping with a picture of me and Buford the lion in an MRI. Now this was 25 years ago and the technology has increased, but 25 years ago it was pretty unusual to do an MRI, and so that was just kind of fun.

Mike Roth: 6:24

What did you have to bring him to you do an MRI in rural? Where was the machine that you brought him to?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 6:31

In our local hospital.

Mike Roth: 6:32

You had one.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 6:33

In Bloomfield yeah, Davis County Hospital, and so that was exciting. And then, when we found out that it was his liver that was malfunctioning, we adjusted his diet and he got to feeling a lot better. And so his companion Lioness was named Kenya and I went out to see her, and again, I've been taking care of her since she was a cub and Kenya came up to me. She was about 300 pounds. She came up to me and she wrapped her front paws around my waist and she's looking at me straight in the face. I wasn't scared of her because I knew her, she knew me and she was really giving me a hug. However, I looked at her great big canine teeth that were looking me right in the face and, without showing any fear, I reached behind my back. I pulled one paw off, I pulled the other paw off and I gently sat her back down all four feet on the ground and slowly backed up out of the cage. I don't think she would have hurt me, but if she would have wanted to, she could have had me.

Mike Roth: 7:38

A very different kind of practice working with wild animals.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 7:42

I imagine yes, yes, and I wasn't particularly trained in this. This was just something I was helping my friends with that had developed this small private zoo.

Mike Roth: 7:54

What were some of your more interesting experiences working with regular animals? Investigate it. Well, one time I had a mare prolapse her uterus and these are things A lot of listeners might not know what that means.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 8:08

Okay. So she had a colt. She was about a 1500 pound Belgian mare. She had had a colt. It was really cold, it was probably 10 degrees outside, snowing, it was an Amish barn, and so there was no lights, no heat went in there and her uterus had turned inside out. So then my husband had to hold the uterus up and I literally had to use the top of my head to push the uterus back into her body, and she had a colt the next year. So she, I guess you did a good job. She survived.

Mike Roth: 8:46

That's good. I always like to tell a joke during the show for my grandson, Evan. Find out if you're listening, Evan. Here it is. I had to find a joke that featured animals for you. Why do birds fly south in the winter, Pam?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 8:59

To enjoy Florida.

Mike Roth: 9:01

I don't know it's much faster than walking, oh Okay.

Dr Craig Curtis: 9:08

Yes.

Mike Roth: 9:09

What got you involved with the Marion County Therapeutic Riding Association?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 9:14

Well, after I had retired it took me a couple of years to just heal my body. I was so tired and after I got in, I love the villages and I was able to enjoy all the villages had. But my body was tired, I was burned out.

Mike Roth: 9:32

How did you become aware of the villages?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 9:34

Oh, we looked and looked when my husband now we've been married about five years he saw that I was just about done and he was afraid for my well-being and so we started looking. We looked in Arizona, flagstaff, all around on the coast of Florida, branson, missouri, and a friend, a high school friend of mine, who I had reconnected with in Facebook we used to be real dear friends in high school she was into berries and she said come look at Central Florida. I said why did you pick Central Florida? We're looking in the coast. She's just come visit me.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 10:10

So I went to the Central Veterinary Conference in Orlando and then we came and visited them and the minute we drove into Central Florida and stayed with them, we knew this was it. Now my mom, my dad, had just recently passed and they were in Bella Vista, arkansas. And my mom said if you go to Florida, I'm going to the villages. And I'm like why the villages, mom? Well, that's where everybody goes. So we brought her here, we did a trolley tour and Jim and I looked at each other and said okay, this is it. After spending about three years looking and looking, we did one trolley tour and said this is it.

Mike Roth: 10:50

So that was it. The trolley tour is so ubiquitous for people who move into the villages that I run the Improvisational Theater Club. We have created a special improv number for the villages trolley tour. Quite funny. It's going to be in the November 7th improv show at Ezell Rec Center and tickets are going to go on sale about August 7th. You can go to the improv website, thevillagesimprov. com, look at the calendar or the lead page and it'll give you the link to get tickets. Well, that show that we did in February sold out about three weeks. Oh okay, I love improv.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 11:28

Do you yeah?

Mike Roth: 11:29

Oh, we always could use another improv there.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 11:31

Well, no, I would be really bad at it, but I love watching other people do it.

Mike Roth: 11:34

Oh yeah we have fun. We have a lot of fun. We have a little trip this weekend. We're going to Sarasota where they have the improv festival. They have 28 improv troops from around the world coming in to do stuff. They have workshops on Saturday afternoon, so it should be a lot of fun. So tell us a little bit about what you do at the Marion Therapeutic Writing Association and how does it help people.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 11:57

Well, I was going to start to say when I, after I got to feeling better, I knew that God wasn't finished with me, that I still, once I had my health back, I needed to give back. So I started looking for someplace that I could use my talents. Did not want to go back into practice, but when I read this article about them, I decided that maybe this would be some place that I could use my veterinary skills, and so I went and got acquainted with them and fell in love with them, and so I do help with the herd health. But what I really found was that I fell in love with the kids and I spent my career taking care of the horses. They were okay. I've offered my veterinary skills, but where I really enjoy is the kids.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 12:45

I work with the So zo kids and the Arnett house, which are foster kids getting ready to age out of the system, and I also. The girls that have really caught my heart are the hands of Mercy girls, and these are the teenagers that they've been exploited and they they might have children, they might have been kicked out of their home and I just spent some time with them yesterday and they are lovely girls that have just been mistreated and we let. We teach them how to ride, we do ground work with them, teach them how to groom the horses, and then I feed them a meal, and so we sit down at a table and we eat together and they have really, really stolen my heart, and so I saw that they had a need for the board member and I agreed to be a board member and since we've had some changes and we are improving the facilities and we've received some substantial donations that have allowed us to put in some better facilities and programs and ICS growing.

Mike Roth: 13:56

Where is the Marion County Therapeutic Riding Association located?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 14:00

It's in Ocala north of Bellevue.

Mike Roth: 14:03

This is Mike Roth with Dr Craig Curtis with today's Alzheimer's tip. Dr Curtis, in past tips you've told our listeners to walk as a good exercise five days a week. Is there any other exercise that they can do which will be beneficial to their brains, which is not going to be terribly exerting or can be accomplished by people who have weak hip joints or weak knee joints or shoulder joints?

Dr Craig Curtis: 14:27

Absolutely Any type of exercise what we call moderate exercise can help brain health, such as a stationary bicycle Simply pedaling a stationary bicycle. It's very low stress on the joints, it's very good for your heart and very good for your brain. With over 20 years of experience studying brain health, dr Curtis's goal is to educate the village's community on how to live a longer, healthier life. To learn more, visit his website, craigcurtismd. com, or call 352-500-5252 to attend a free seminar.

Mike Roth: 15:00

Okay, yeah, I've noticed that the whole area here in Ocala, central Florida, is West Country it is a much.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 15:08

Yes, there is a lot of horse facilities in Ocala. It is the horse capital of the world, or that's what they call themselves.

Mike Roth: 15:16

The request here in Center is quite spectacular. It's amazing.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 15:19

Jason Reynolds, who is the executive director of the Florida Horse Park, is also on our board.

Mike Roth: 15:26

I've never been to the Florida Horse Park. What is that all about?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 15:29

It's just another place for them to have horse shows and it's a very nice facility. Unfortunately, the World Quastering Center kind of overshadows it, but it has its place in having horse shows.

Mike Roth: 15:43

Grand Oaks is nice too.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 15:44

Yes, it is Very nice. See a couple of shows there.

Mike Roth: 15:47

Yeah, Perhaps you can give our listeners a couple of tips, for perhaps you can give our listeners who have pets look for a veterinarian.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 15:56

So in the timeframe from when I started practicing to what we look for now in a small community, we look mostly for personality. You are with your veterinarian, you're going to church with them, you're going to ball games with them, and so it's like proximity and you get to know your veterinarian. But now veterinarian, veterinary medicine, has changed. It is more corporate and less personal and so it's harder to pick a veterinarian because they're multi-doctor practices. You might not see the same vet twice. That's a problem. And you don't develop a personal relationship with some of the bigger practices and more and more practices are becoming corporate and with the corporate they have to do more things in a. They have a checklist that they have to do, which increases the price because the corporation is wanting to have X amount of dollars.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 16:56

So this impersonalizes the veterinarian. It also increases on the smaller practices. It increases the pressure to get more technology. So you have to have more investment. Even if you're a small practice, you have to have the X-ray machines, the ultrasound machines, the blood work machines, because that's what your competition also has, which increases the price of your services. And another thing that I am glad I'm not practicing anymore is the effect of social media on veterinary medicine and on doctors, because I am glad that not every person I ever saw, every animal ever treated, didn't end up on a social media site so that you are constantly being scrutinized. You have to watch your reputation and my son is actually in the business of helping wellness professionals maintain their reputation because one bad review can really destroy you Not one, but it hurts.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 18:06

It hurts and personally I'm glad I don't have to read what some people thought you would do the best you could, but you can't please everybody. Or there's misperceptions or there's bad outcomes and the next thing you know you're all over social media as being such and such and that would have destroyed me. I couldn't have taken it, I couldn't have read that, and it does cause a lot of harm in a lot of professions. But veterinarians are especially kind of kind-hearted and we don't like it when people don't like us.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 18:41

And so you see a lot of depression and Depression in veterinarians. In veterinarians because they are being constantly scrutinized and analyzed and talked about on social media. I see it all the time, even like on talk of the villages or the Facebook pages.

Mike Roth: 19:02

You know, such and such didn't do this for me or or I didn't have a good experience here, and sometimes there's misunderstandings, yeah, and probably 20 years ago in the dental practice area there became a group of vendors who were selling dental practice software and then practice management training and frankly I was annoyed by that. And then I discovered that there were veterinarian practice management softwares and vendors who were selling veterinarian practice management to veterinarians using a very extremely sales oriented approach and they were using a series of techniques which were akin to creating a franchise.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 19:49

And this is exactly what happened. I was there, I was going to all of those marketing and a lot of times you knew that the same people were giving the dental offices and the veterinary offices the same advice to try to increase your sales, not procedures, but the practices were the same and I sat there and I watched it. 20 years ago I went to many of those marketing seminars just trying to help my own business and I started seeing the trend and then I started seeing that you have to have your average price ticket. Let's do this because that will increase your average price ticket and I didn't see the value in it. I didn't really see it necessary.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 20:30

I'm in a small rural practice they're going to they aren't going to agree to do that, and then I have to go sit in church or sit down at the softball game or the baseball game with them and I did not want them to think that I had just charged them for a procedure that wasn't really necessary. It wasn't unnecessary blood test, exactly. I had clients come Okay, I'm in southeast Iowa. I had clients come from Chicago and Colorado Springs. They've had family in Bloomfield and so they would come to me, bring their animals all the way from Chicago or Colorado Springs just to save money, because they knew I wouldn't charge them thousands of dollars to pull a tooth you know, or something like that.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 21:13

I had that quite a bit because I started seeing what was going on in our industry.

Mike Roth: 21:19

Yeah, I lived in Cincinnati for many years and in the first two suburban belts around Cincinnati there were, I thought, far too many veterinarians per square mile and I think it hurt some of the practices. I didn't see the impact of social media, but I'll believe it. Here in the villages, with talk of the villages, it's everywhere now.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 21:42

It is everywhere now and it is. And also another thing that technology is doing to our practices is now you have to have sophisticated software to send out your reminders, to track. You know all your vaccination. Now, I did that too, but you had to do all of this extra. You had to have all of this extra technology in order to be competitive, and all of that is very expensive. All that software, all of the technology is expensive, and so if you're a small practice, like I was I was a solo practitioner I couldn't afford that.

Mike Roth: 22:21

So did you have an assistant or a nurse that helped you?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 22:25

I did, I had staff.

Mike Roth: 22:26

Okay, so all the computer programs. They had to learn the computer program when the program didn't work right. Yeah, yeah so.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 22:33

I was, I didn't have a real sophisticated system Because, like I said, I would just see them at the grocery store and say, hey, don't forget, or how is your dog doing, but I, if you were in a larger area, you wouldn't have that availability.

Mike Roth: 22:53

Well, there's a difference.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 22:54

I had a more accountability to my clients because they were my friends. They knew you, they knew me Right, they knew where to find me, they knew where I was going to be at.

Mike Roth: 23:02

Right. So today the practitioners can hide.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 23:06

Yes, the joke I tell in our town is you didn't need to turn on your blinker because everybody knew where you were going to turn anyway.

Mike Roth: 23:16

That small town.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 23:17

Yeah, small town.

Mike Roth: 23:18

Right, not even having a traffic light.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 23:21

No, we had one, one traffic light.

Mike Roth: 23:23

Yeah, probably a stop sign too.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 23:24

Yeah, I also was involved with organized veterinary medicine and I was on the board of the Iowa Veterinary Medical Association.

Mike Roth: 23:34

Okay.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 23:34

And one of the concerns I had over the years and I would say this, I don't know if I is rural America was not being taken care of. We were having lots and lots of veterinarians but they were all going to small animal practices in large towns and it was getting harder and harder to get veterinarians to go into the rural communities. And because it's harder, you know, pulling calves, going out on farm calls is harder and there was a lot of more women in the veterinarians schools being they were graduating mostly women who a lot of them, went into this large or the companion animal side and many of the men went into the companion animal side and it became harder and harder to get the rural practices Dr.

Mike Roth: 24:24

So that would suggest that the scarcity of veterinarians for rural practices would naturally drive up the price of rural services, dr.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 24:32

it would. And it was much harder to be a rural, you know, because you were all on your own. You couldn't get an associate to come help you. Dr Darrell, Bock why? Dr Darrell Bock. It just was a hard life, dr Darrell.

Mike Roth: 24:44

it's a hard life, d.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 24:45

I did all of my own emergencies for 37 years, dr Darrell.

Mike Roth: 24:49

So seven days a week, 24 hours a day, you were on call.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 24:53

I was, and I worked seven days a week because I did my own chores. So on Sunday morning before I went to church I was in taking care of the animals. On Sunday afternoon I'd be back in there. I worked every Saturday and it's exhausting and I was also a single mother.

Dr Craig Curtis: 25:09

Dr Darrell.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 25:09

Bock. So my poor kids had to, and one of the stories I like to tell is when they would hear the phone ring at three o'clock in the morning, they would just roll out of bed, put on their little cowboy boots, put on their little car heart jackets and go where are we going now? Mom, I had to take them everywhere with me for 10 years until they were old enough to stay home by themselves. Dr Darrell Bock.

Mike Roth: 25:30

On the other side of the coin, you could say you gave them some good training in what being an independent business person really is. Dr.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 25:36

Yes, of the. My oldest son still has not forgiven me for this, but we were golfing one time and I was on the phone. I was putting one handed and on the phone and he goes mom, we are on vacation, you aren't supposed to be working. I'm like, I have to, I just have to, and he was so mad at me. 20 years later, we're on a boat, I'm retired, I'm sitting there enjoying things and he is pacing the dock on a phone call for work and I'm laughing at him and he goes okay, mom, I get it now, dr.

Mike Roth: 26:13

Now.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 26:14

but he didn't forgive me for many years that I was taking a phone call while we were golfing Dr Darrell.

Mike Roth: 26:21

So when you were on vacation, did you actually leave the area of your practice, dr?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 26:26

I did but I had a telephone with me neighboring practitioners who would take care of my clients, but only because they had to call them. You had to call another practice because I wasn't there. I did not bring in somebody who could take over my practice while I was gone, so I just had to leave my practice unattended. My first son I took a month off. My second son two hours after I had Chase, my second son I'm on the phone talking to a client two hours after he was born. I went back to work full time when he was two weeks old. One time I had to wrap him up in a little blanket and set him on a belay and pull some lambs. It was cold. It was about to put my little baby on the belay and did my work, picked him up, took him with me.

Mike Roth: 27:17

Well, that's good, you didn't forget him, Dr..

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 27:19

Bock.

Dr Craig Curtis: 27:19

Yeah, I didn't forget him.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 27:23

One time I looked at my truck and there were two pillows, a blanket, a TV and two bowls of macaroni and cheese in my Ford Ranger, Dr Darrell.

Dr Craig Curtis: 27:33

.

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 27:33

And I thought these poor kids. But you know what I had to do, what I had to do, dr.

Mike Roth: 27:40

Yeah, I mean, that's good, dr Darrell d. D

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 27:42

They just had to go with me. They grew up, okay, .

Mike Roth: 27:46

Bock, I think they probably grew up with a better sense of what business is,

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 27:50

Oh yes, Dr Darrell Bock.

Mike Roth: 27:51

And probably are better people because of it. So, Pam, before we go, if someone wants information about the therapeutic writing association up in Marion, how do they get in touch with the group? Why don't you tell us how they can get in touch with the Marion Therapeutic Writing Association, dr?

Dr. Pam Pierceall: 28:08

Yes, if they would like to look up our website, it is mtraokala. org, or they can call our office at 352-732-7300. We're always looking for volunteers, and if anybody would like to help us with some donations or would like to come out and help lead horses or help us in any other way, we are always looking for volunteers. D.

Mike Roth: 28:38

Okay, thanks very much for being with us, d.

Emily: 28:39

All right, Thank you, Dr Pa Bock. Remember our next episode will be released next Friday at 9 am. Should you want to become a major supporter of the show or have questions, please contact us at mikeatrothvoice. com. This is ec. om. ecom a shout out for supporters Greg Panjian, Tweet Coleman, Dan Kappellan, Williams, Alvin Stenzel and major supporter Dr Craig Curtis at K2 in the villages. We will be hearing more from Dr Curtis with short Alzheimer's tips each week. If you know someone who should be on the show, contact us at mikeatrothvoice. com. We mikeatrothvoice. com everyone for listening to the show. The content of the show is copyrighted by Rothvoice 2023, All rights reserved.